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whiskerdog1
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Joined: 01 Apr 2005
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Location: Rustbelt

PostPosted: 03/07/08, 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I road my dog to get in shape.
I dont often look at speed but have clocked her once next to my truck at about 30mph for a short distance sprint home.
As stated, Ill make a video, probably take 2 of us as I will have to drive.

The gentleman that bred Timo & Judged him had no reason to lie.
Said the ATV went 30mph & the dog was with him the entire way. Sled dogs can average 20mph pulling a loaded sled.
Ill do some work on it & let you know.

On other issue: There was 1 church, only 1 church, until Martin Luther decided he wanted to Marry his love & asked for a dispensation. He couldnt honor his sacrament of celibacy.
Thats really why Protestanism came about, & inspried his treatise. Its now 33,000 Sects & counting. Divided & Conquered.
If you belong to one of these Sects, it was begun & founded sometime in the last 100-400 years. Dont dance. What year was your Sect founded? Its an honest question..Im just curious.

And so you know, Jesus was not a Jew, nor was Paul.
Jesus was a Judean, specifically a Galillean, born of a Virgin Mother. Paul himself practiced Judaism so Im not sure I get your point! Neither did Paul ever know or meet Jesus.

Jesus was Not an Edomite, look up that word.
There are 12 tribes of Israel, but the largest group in Israel are Jews. Asian, Mongol descendents, former Phallic worshippers & 7th century Converts, aka Ashkenazi Jews from Khazaria Asia from the Caucus region.
See Revelations 2:9 or John 8:44..Jesus referred to them in a strong manner.

Most All of the Apostles gained converts, and why we have so many Rites of the Church ie Maronite, Chaldean, Syriac, Orthodox, Roman etc. Paul is considered the greatest Missionary but was not the head of the Church, that titled was bestowed to Peter By Christ..
Paul was eventually martyred by the Jewish Mob, crucified upside down, as you well know. Even among the most staunch of Protestants, Calvin or Luther, Neither Ever thought or preached that Paul was the head of the Church. That is insane & Biblically unsound. It is Apostate & without any merit
Interesting to note that the Only time the words "BY Faith Alone" are used (once in the entire bible) James 2:24—where it is rejected as a description of how we are justified. .

FYI-Heres the most widely known & Popular Protestant Preacher in the USA, saying Jesus was Not the Messiah & THe Church is the whore of Babylon (not Jerusalem or Israel of course whom he worships) & other non sense. McCain is now distancing himself away from Hagee, who endorsed him. This is now the sad state of affairs with Christianity today.. Can you say Divided & Conquered?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8khCJTDD44

Far as Wisconisn goes, yes i loved hunting there.
But non resident Deer tags got so pricy & Family was offered good money for the land, used to grow Christ-Mass Trees. It backed up to a State Forest so we had lots of land to hunt on. Lots of turkey, grouse, rabbits, & varmits. Dog once caught a Mink. I have it stuffed in my den!
Was a Deer haven. Never huge racks like my neck of the woods, but very large deer.
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PostPosted: 03/08/08, 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whiskerdog1 wrote:
I road my dog to get in shape.
I dont often look at speed but have clocked her once next to my truck at about 30mph for a short distance sprint home.
As stated, Ill make a video, probably take 2 of us as I will have to drive.

The gentleman that bred Timo & Judged him had no reason to lie.
Said the ATV went 30mph & the dog was with him the entire way. Sled dogs can average 20mph pulling a loaded sled.
Ill do some work on it & let you know.



Of course you do! I do to.. I prefer to do it off my rollerblades if I can find a paved trail with enought grass shoulder on the side for the dog to run on then he can pull me and he really gets strong. Then when he tires I can skate to keep up with his trott. After a min or two I can give him the "lets go" and get him running hard again until he hits his limit and give him another trotting rest. I keep that up for about an hour or I used to since now he can't do that.



Quote:
On other issue: There was 1 church, only 1 church, until Martin Luther decided he wanted to Marry his love & asked for a dispensation. He couldnt honor his sacrament of celibacy.
Thats really why Protestanism came about, & inspried his treatise. Its now 33,000 Sects & counting. Divided & Conquered.
If you belong to one of these Sects, it was begun & founded sometime in the last 100-400 years. Dont dance. What year was your Sect founded? Its an honest question..Im just curious.


I don't know why you want to abuse yourself like this.. Let me list the churches....
Antioch
Asia and there were mutilple ones there.
Cenchrea
Caesarea
Cilicia
Corinth
Ephesus
Galatia
Laodicea
Pergamos
Philadelphia
Sardis
Smyrna
Syria
Thessalonica
Thyatira

Funny How I don't see the Roman Catholic Church in this list.. Since there was only one according to you...

You see so now there is the first misnomer that you present that is easy to defeat are you ready for the rest..?


Quote:
And so you know, Jesus was not a Jew, nor was Paul.
Jesus was a Judean, specifically a Galillean, born of a Virgin Mother. Paul himself practiced Judaism so Im not sure I get your point! Neither did Paul ever know or meet Jesus.

Jew means a Juedan :A corrupted form, doubtless, of Judah, and applied to the people of the kingdom

Quote:
Jesus was Not an Edomite, look up that word.
There are 12 tribes of Israel, but the largest group in Israel are Jews. Asian, Mongol descendents, former Phallic worshippers & 7th century Converts, aka Ashkenazi Jews from Khazaria Asia from the Caucus region.
See Revelations 2:9 or John 8:44..Jesus referred to them in a strong manner.


You are getting this stuff from your Catholic cut and paste site again aren't you.

Have you looked at Jesus's Geneology saying He is not an Edomite dosen't make him not a JEW.. All Jews come from Abraham I am sure there are or were some converts that came in but they were few.

Quote:
Most All of the Apostles gained converts, and why we have so many Rites of the Church ie Maronite, Chaldean, Syriac, Orthodox, Roman etc. Paul is considered the greatest Missionary but was not the head of the Church, that titled was bestowed to Peter By Christ..


Not this nonsense again.

Rites of Churches is that like sects? Why I would bet it is. Now for all of the apostles gaining converts... Why did Peter agree to go only to the JEWS and Paul to the Gentiles? It is recorded in many places in the bible..

Here is one: Galatians 2: 7-9
7But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;

8(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)

9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

Now we would expect this since Jesus himself said this about Paul...


Acts 9:15
15But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:

Quote:
Paul was eventually martyred by the Jewish Mob, crucified upside down, as you well know. Even among the most staunch of Protestants, Calvin or Luther, neither ever thought or preached that Paul was the head of the Church. That is insane & Biblically incorrect. It is apostate.


I think you mean Peter! Yeah by a Jewish mob just like the Jewish leaders who had Paul going out and killing the first converts. Remember Stephen?
Right after that God cut off Israel and went with his dispensation of grace thru Paul.. If you look at the list of the people there at the stoning of Stephen in Acts 6, It would be like having the congress, senate, president and the supreme court all there.

12And they stirred up the people, and the elders, and the scribes, and came upon him, and caught him, and brought him to the council,


Well this is where God said "If you don't want to accept me then I will go to the gentiles without you" "I promised you a kingdom but you regect the king so I will not give it to you" He went to the gentiles without them as Peter notices himself:
Acts 11:
18When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.


Quote:
FYI-Heres the most Prominant Preacher in the USA, saying Jesus was Not the Messiah & THe Church is the whore of Babylon (not Jerusalem or Israel) and other non sense. McCain is now distancing himself away from Hagee, who endorsed him. This is now the sad state of affairs with Christianity today..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8khCJTDD44


I can't watch that video were I am now but I have heard Hagee before and there are somethings he is right on and some he is not. I have heard the whore of babylon argument before and it is unconvincing to me.. If he is saying that Jesus is not the Messiah then he has lost his marbles.

It shows how unchristian he is if he would endorce McCain. So by his very endorsement of McCain he proves that he isn't Christian at all but probably like Pat Roberts and Post Christian since he like Guliiani and he is totally evil. Since McCain is a liberal with an (R) behind his name. But the dummies who vote REpublican will vote for this liberal only on the basis that the Democrats are worse.. When I ask them on what moral issue are they worse they can't give me one. Since McCain is pro choice. Pro Homo, Pro Gun control, Anti Free Speech. He is a liberal.. His big thing to wuuoo over the conservatives is that the will appoint strict constructionist judges.. We have a liberal Supreme court now that can't seem to read the 14 ammendment to constitution. We don't need more judges like Alito or Roberts or Scalia or Thomas.. None of them can find the right to life which is clearly deliniated in the 14 amendment.

So once the state sanctions murder the society and culture has gone lawless since all law is based on your right to life...

Quote:
Far as Wisconisn goes, yes i loved hunting there.
But non resident Deer tags got so pricy & Family was offered good money for the land, used to grow Christ-Mass Trees. It backed up to a State Forest so we had lots of land to hunt on. Lots of turkey, grouse, rabbits, & varmits. Dog once caught a Mink. I have it stuffed in my den!
Was a Deer haven. Never huge racks like my neck of the woods, but very large deer.


Well what can I say economics can dictate where you hunt and if you hunt.
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whiskerdog1
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PostPosted: 03/09/08, 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like roller blades too but Im not to good at stopping, Ive yet to have a fall however. Luck on my side.

Yes, clearly Hagee says Jesus "Did Not come to earth to be the Messiah." Watch it. Its only 1 minute in length..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8khCJTDD44
These maniacs, now 60% of US Christians, have destroyed this nation & our religion. They push for more war, WW3, provoking it, ..to bring about their 1 way ticket to heaven, least they think so. Defying Gods Commandmants & wrecking our economy in the process with endless, costly war.

All of those Churches you listed...were of one body. There was 1 Vicar, that title 1st bestowed to Peter from Jesus.
Matthew 16:18: "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church." (This Rock, My Church..No plural)
Peter is mentioned 159 times in the NT, more than any other apostle.

Not All Jews come from Abraham & Precisey my point.
The largest population of Jews in Israel, come from Khazaria Asia, the 13th tribe. They were 7th century Converts. See Revelations 2:9

Benjamin Friedman..
"During Jesus' lifetime, No persons were described as "Jews" anywhere. That fact is supported by theology, history and science. When Jesus was in Judea, it was not the "homeland" of the ancestors of those who today style themselves "Jews". Their ancestors never set a foot in Judea. They existed at that time in Asia, their "homeland", and were known as Khazars. In none of the manuscripts of the original Old or New Testament was Jesus described or referred to as a "Jew". The term originated in the late 18th century as an abbreviation of the term Judean and refers to a resident of Judea without regard to race or religion, just as the term "Texan" signifies a person living in Texas.

Judea and Galilee were 2 separate states and political entities, as illustrated on the map of Palestine in the time of our Saviour in your Bible. Jesus Himself was Not a Jew (Judean) or resident of Judea, He was a Galilean or resident of Galilee (Matthew 26:69; John 7:41), and a Judahite or descendent of the Tribe of Judah. The Judeans of prominence were not of the Tribe of Judah, but of Edomites. Pilate was being ironic when he wrote the sign "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Judeans" for the Cross (John 19:19). That is, "the Galilean who was King of the Judeans," as in "Queen Victoria of England, Empress of India." Jesus grew up in Nazareth in Galilee. His disciples were fishermen from the Sea of Galilee. And although He visited Jerusalem, he spent most of His life in his home country of Galilee. John 7:1, "After this Jesus stayed in Galilee; for He could not walk in Judea, because the Jews sought to kill him." His followers were constrained "for fear of the Jews" (John 7:13, 19:38, 20:19)."

Psalm 83:3 says God's elect are "hidden" or protected ones, and that they are under attack from a coalition of evil groups led by Edom

Some of the Churches/Rites you listed, worship still in their respective Rites, via the Apostle that Founded them & were/ are in Unity with Rome & subordinate to The Vicar.
Rites are NOT Sects.
"There was a faction in Corinth, a church founded by Paul, which submitted itself to Peter. Peter also traveled to fellowship with the young church in Antioch."
The 1st Council in 325, Nicene, those churches & others, were present. Rome & Constantinople were the headquarters of Christianity throughout History.

Paul, a Pharisse & later convert who became a missionary in & out of the Synagogues. Former Rabbi not officially an apostle & Never knew Jesus. Later Beheaded by the Jewish Mobs under Nero who Crucifed Peter as well. Paul preached throughout the Middle East, but Peter in Palestine mostly crucified in Rome.
Peter was the bridge holding together the diverse people of the early church (Acts 15) with James assuming the leadership of the Jerusalem Church.



Catholics & Orthodox Christians go by Sacred Tradition. Without it there would be no theology of the Trinity.
If we went by the Bible only, then what happened to those people who before the year 1400 that had no printed Bible?
They did not all go to hell because of that. The Bible came to us 1400 years after Christ. There were no printing presses until then...

If The WORD or Bible was all that was required for Salvation, Jesus wouldve simply come down, had his scribes record his words & teachings.
Tradition as evidence in Paul’s letters is clear.
In 1 Corinthians, for example, Paul twice refers to traditions being “received” and “delivered.” (1 Cor. 11:23, 15:3). This is technical rabbinical language for the passing along of a controlled oral tradition.

PROTESTANT stems from Protest.
Something had to be protested, that which was there first...Catholicism. That was what THe Protestant revolt was. A protest against THE Church..the "ground & Pillar of the Truth" by a man (Martin Luther) who could Not honor his sacrament of celibacy.
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PostPosted: 03/09/08, 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

whiskerdog1 wrote:
I like roller blades too but Im not to good at stopping, Ive yet to have a fall however. Luck on my side.


Well then you haven't done it enough. I played hockey for 20+ years and can skate but if you do it enough with the dog and have skunks cats and other dog owners around you WILL get caught up in the lead and take a digger.

Quote:
Yes, clearly Hagee says Jesus "Did Not come to earth to be the Messiah." Watch it. Its only 1 minute in length..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8khCJTDD44
These maniacs, now 60% of US Christians, have destroyed this nation & our religion. They push for more war, WW3, provoking it, ..to bring about their 1 way ticket to heaven, least they think so. Defying Gods Commandmants & wrecking our economy in the process with endless, costly war.


He says that Jesus didn't claim to be the messiah which was one thing that he told his disciples not to tell others that he was.. I have read some of Hagees books and when I didn't know better they seemed to make sense. There were still verses that caused problems for his theology but he just ignored them just like you do!.. As I will show below..

Quote:
All of those Churches you listed...were of one body. There was 1 Vicar, that title 1st bestowed to Peter from Jesus.
Matthew 16:18: "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church." (This Rock, My Church..No plural)
Peter is mentioned 159 times in the NT, more than any other apostle.


Now here is it all in context BILL this also answers your objection to Hagee:
Matthew 16
13When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say the Son of Man is?"
14They replied, "Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets."

15"But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?"

16Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ,[b] the Son of the living God."

17Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven. 18And I tell you that you are Peter [in the greek petroswhich means small stones,[c] and on this rock[in the greek petra which means foundation stone or bedrock] I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[d] will not overcome it.[e] 19I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be[f] bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be[g] loosed in heaven." 20Then he warned his disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Christ.

You see it was the foundation that He was the Christ the Messiah that He would build his church not on Peter a fallible man who would later deny Him and be untruthful about the gospel. This is the whole context of this passage.

Now did Peter have a significant role to play? Absolutely but he was not the vicar over any of the churches that Paul founded that is just inane.



Quote:
Not All Jews come from Abraham & Precisey my point.
The largest population of Jews in Israel, come from Khazaria Asia, the 13th tribe. They were 7th century Converts. See Revelations 2:9


But Jesus did! That is why there is a Genealogy given to prove that he was who the prophesies said He was. If we were to go by what you are saying then Jesus was not the Messiah was he since he wasn't a child of Abraham.

Quote:
Benjamin Friedman..
"During Jesus' lifetime, No persons were described as "Jews" anywhere. That fact is supported by theology, history and science. When Jesus was in Judea, it was not the "homeland" of the ancestors of those who today style themselves "Jews". Their ancestors never set a foot in Judea. They existed at that time in Asia, their "homeland", and were known as Khazars. In none of the manuscripts of the original Old or New Testament was Jesus described or referred to as a "Jew". The term originated in the late 18th century as an abbreviation of the term Judean and refers to a resident of Judea without regard to race or religion, just as the term "Texan" signifies a person living in Texas.

Judea and Galilee were 2 separate states and political entities, as illustrated on the map of Palestine in the time of our Saviour in your Bible. Jesus Himself was Not a Jew (Judean) or resident of Judea, He was a Galilean or resident of Galilee (Matthew 26:69; John 7:41), and a Judahite or descendent of the Tribe of Judah. The Judeans of prominence were not of the Tribe of Judah, but of Edomites. Pilate was being ironic when he wrote the sign "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Judeans" for the Cross (John 19:19). That is, "the Galilean who was King of the Judeans," as in "Queen Victoria of England, Empress of India." Jesus grew up in Nazareth in Galilee. His disciples were fishermen from the Sea of Galilee. And although He visited Jerusalem, he spent most of His life in his home country of Galilee. John 7:1, "After this Jesus stayed in Galilee; for He could not walk in Judea, because the Jews sought to kill him." His followers were constrained "for fear of the Jews" (John 7:13, 19:38, 20:19)."



Mark 10:47

47When he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to shout, "Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!"

Thus he was an Israelite genetically by blood.

You need to get your information from different sources.


Quote:
Psalm 83:3 says God's elect are "hidden" or protected ones, and that they are under attack from a coalition of evil groups led by Edom

Some of the Churches/Rites you listed, worship still in their respective Rites, via the Apostle that Founded them & were/ are in Unity with Rome & subordinate to The Vicar.
Rites are NOT Sects.


So what is the difference? since in your estimation it is your relationship with your denomination (Catholic) that makes you a Christian correct?

I think you purposely try to discredit Protestant Christianity by calling all of them sects.
When in fact there are just a few denominations which differ because of their confusion over when God went from law to grace with the Apostle Paul. Which is the Big problem with Catholicism. They too are confused by this and are not on the same page as God..

Now there are a lot of Cults and pseudo Christians but you can tell who they are by asking them if Jesus was God if they say no then they aren't Christian. The unitarians are one of the more popular groups that hold to this position and I am sure you are counting them in there. Your 33,000 sects is bogus and you know it.

Quote:
"There was a faction in Corinth, a church founded by Paul, which submitted itself to Peter. Peter also traveled to fellowship with the young church in Antioch."


Yeah there was and Paul rebuked them for being fools!

Quote:
The 1st Council in 325, Nicene, those churches & others, were present. Rome & Constantinople were the headquarters of Christianity throughout History.

This council was called together by the Roman Emperor Constantine I, since he became a convert.
Not because Peter founded the Church there it was Paul who went there. Ever hear of a book called ROMANS it was Paul whom the bible records as GOD saying,
Acts 23:11
The following night the Lord stood near Paul and said, "Take courage! As you have testified about me in Jerusalem, so you must also testify in Rome."
He wanted Paul to go there not Peter and no where in the bible "the bible that as you say was given to us by the Catholic Church" does it record that Peter even went there now does it? It is your tradition that say that not the scriptures. Peter played a big role at first but when God cut off Israel then He went with Paul and Peters role diminished. Just look at how many times after Paul gets saved in Acts 9 Peter gets mentioned. In acts 10 He is being shown by God that God is going to the Gentiles without Peter. This is were most people get confused in the bible and why they have such screwy doctrine and why there are so many denomination.


Quote:
Paul, a Pharisse & later convert who became a missionary in & out of the Synagogues. Former Rabbi not officially an apostle & Never knew Jesus. Later Beheaded by the Jewish Mobs under Nero who Crucifed Peter as well. Paul preached throughout the Middle East, but Peter in Palestine mostly crucified in Rome.


[size=18]Never Offically an APOSTLE What are you NUTZ[/size]
Romans 1:1
Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God—

1 Corinthians 1:1
Paul, called to be an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and our brother Sosthenes,

2 Corinthians 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, To the church of God in Corinth, together with all the saints throughout Achaia:


Galatians 1:1
Paul, an apostle—sent not from men nor by man, but by Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead—
Galatians 2:1
[ Paul Accepted by the Apostles ] Fourteen years later I went up again to Jerusalem, this time with Barnabas. I took Titus along also.

Ephesians 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To the saints in Ephesus, the faithful in Christ Jesus:

Colossians 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and Timothy our brother,

1 Timothy 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus our hope,

2 Timothy 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, according to the promise of life that is in Christ Jesus,

Titus 1:1
Paul, a servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ for the faith of God's elect and the knowledge of the truth that leads to godliness—

Are you kidding me? Paul not an apostle officially are you nuts?

Here God makes him ONE officially.
Acts 9 : 15
15 But the Lord said to Ananias, "Go! This man is my chosen instrument to carry my name before the Gentiles and their kings and before the people of Israel.


Quote:
Peter was the bridge holding together the diverse people of the early church (Acts 15) with James assuming the leadership of the Jerusalem Church.


He wasn't holding anything together you really need to read the bible once for yourself so that you see the story of what is happening.

Peter is stuck in Israel preaching only to his converts who were Israelites who still followed all the mosaic law and put their faith in Jesus. But Paul taught that you didn't need the mosaic law you just needed to put your faith in Jesus. "for it is by grace that ye are saved through faith, not of works lest any man should boast". This was in conflict with what Peter was teaching since Peter had walked with Jesus for 3 years. Jesus taught the LAW. The prophesy was that when the Messiah came that Israel would get a kingdom. Which is why in Acts one they ask Jesus "Are you going to restore the Kingdom now?" Jesus ascends in to heaven and the 12 begin preaching. But Israel as a nation rejects Jesus, the leaders, scribes, Pharisees, temple guards, lawyers, saduciees so God cuts them off and doesn't give them the Kingdom that was promised and Calls the APOSTLE Paul to now go to preach his new message of salvation by grace through faith. God cuts off Israel and goes to the Gentiles through Paul.
Peter comes to one of Paul's Churches in Galatians 2 and Paul rebukes Peter for being untruthful about the Gospel. Peter tried to get Paul's converts to follow the mosaic law and Paul was Pissed to say the least He called Peter a Hypocrite to his face.

Peter didn't hold anything together. It was Peter, James and John and the Super Apostles as Paul called them who were screwing up what Paul was teaching. And what Paul was teaching came straight from GOD not from Peter or any man. Paul says that himself. Galatians 1:11 11 I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel I preached is not something that man made up. 12I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.

Catholics & Orthodox Christians go by Sacred Tradition. Without it there would be no theology of the Trinity.

That is not true. Since in the bible Jesus clearly speaks that He must go tot he Father so that the Father can send the Holy spirit to them. Where do you get this nonsense?

And Jesus spoke against traditions the contradict scripture. You know that don't you so which do you think he held in higher esteem?

Quote:
If we went by the Bible only, then what happened to those people who before the year 1400 that had no printed Bible?
They did not all go to hell because of that. The Bible came to us 1400 years after Christ. There were no printing presses until then...


You are saved by Faith in Jesus not by reading. And when Paul went and saved his converts there was no bible now was there. The only thing they had was the Old testament. And from that he proved that Jesus was the Christ and saved many. (Can't wait to meet him)

You know that they copied Pauls letters and Peters letters to the Jewsih converts and they had the Torah. These letters were in circulation between the churches which is why the Nicene counsel was called. Since some of the Gnostics were circulating bogus gospels like the Thomas and Mary. So they did what was prudent and got together and put together all the epistles that they already accepted in one cannon.

Quote:
If The WORD or Bible was all that was required for Salvation, Jesus wouldve simply come down, had his scribes record his words & teachings.
Tradition as evidence in Paul’s letters is clear.
In 1 Corinthians, for example, Paul twice refers to traditions being “received” and “delivered.” (1 Cor. 11:23, 15:3). This is technical rabbinical language for the passing along of a controlled oral tradition.


Pauls traditions that he taught didn't contradict the letters that he wrote that would be inane.

Quote:
PROTESTANT stems from Protest.
Something had to be protested, that which was there first...Catholicism. That was what THe Protestant revolt was. A protest against THE Church..the "ground & Pillar of the Truth" by a man (Martin Luther) who could Not honor his sacrament of celibacy.


Celebicy is not a sacrament it is just a man made bogus rule to confuse people into thinking works of the flesh make you more holy. Didn't Paul warn that there would come a time that this would happen he warned Timothy about this didn't he..
1 Timothy 4 :1-3
1The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. 2Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. 3They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.


Bill Martin Luther was right to protest against the Catholic teaching of celibacy for priests since it is not taught in scripture here are the qualifications for being a pastor or deacon or priest or bishop:

1This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.

2A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

3Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;

4One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;

5(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)

6Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.

7Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

8Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;

9Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.

10And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.

11Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.

12Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.

13For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.




You see Bill when Martin Luther finally got a copy of the Scriptures which were very expensive back in his day since they were hand copied and when they were checked against the master if there was one dot out of place they were burned. Thus it was a very labor intensive thing. He read for himself and found the many of the things he was being told were of God were not they were just the teachings of MEN. Thus he put his 95 thesis on the door and said if you can prove them wrong by scripture or reason I will recant but they couldn't so the reformation was born and with this new freedom and the coming of the printing press europe was being freed from the dark ages that was the result of not having the truth of the bible being taught. This is why the printing press brought about the enlightenment since the word of God is light and once the masses had the truth in their hands they could learn to read which spawned a big growth in knowledge.

So Bill the difference between us is that you count your Christianity in relation to the organization that you belong to (Catholic church). I count mine by my personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Thus I go to the source and this is how God wanted it just like he had a personal relationship with Adam before he screwed it up.

I hope one day you find this relationship..
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PostPosted: 03/10/08, 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ME-I never played hockey-may explain my shortcomings on blades

There was 1 Church ( Not counting the Greek Schism) until Martin Luther posted his treatise & Protestant Revolt. Everyone but you understands this.
If you cant accept that, there is no discusison. I cant argue with the uninformed.
If you wish to claim there were abuses in the church..still are, Ill grant you that. Ill grant you 40 Anti Popes in Church history. But I wont throw out the proverbial baby with the bathwater, as you or Luther, but prefer to believe Christ' promise of.. "the Gates of Hell wont prevail upon My Church"

Hagee Claims
1. "Jews did not reject Jesus" Completely False-("CRUCIFY HIM, MAY HIS BLOOD BE UPON US & OUR CHILDREN!")
2. "Jesus did not come to earth to be the Messiah".. False-"I am He"

Jesus addressed Peter as.."You are Peter & upon THis Rock, I will build My CHURCH"
Saint Peter was the Most Prominent of Jesus Christ's Disciples. Originally named Simon son of Jonah (Matt. 16:17), he was given the Aramaic name Cephas BY Jesus; the name means "rock" & is translated into Greek as Peter. Jesus Trained his disciples personally. Paul Never ever Knew Jesus..

Peter is pictured as a leader & spokesman of the disciples; he identifies Jesus as Messiah (Mark 8:27; Matt. 16:16) He is several times mentioned with the brothers James and John, with whom he witnesses the Transfiguration and Jesus' agony in Gethsemane.
After Jesus' arrest Peter denies knowing him 3 times (as Jesus foretold) & repented his denial (Matt. 26:69-75; John 18:10-27).


In Acts, Peter is a Leader in the Jerusalem church & engages in Missionary activity in Samaria, Galilee, Lydda, Sharon, & Joppa.
Peter favors Admission of Gentiles into the church but occupies a middle position between James (the "brother" of Jesus), who wants to keep Christianity very Jewish in practice, & Paul, who wishes to minimize requirements for Gentile converts.
Peter was Crucified by Nero, upside down in Rome.


Mary was a descendent of the Israelite line. Mary was a Virgin Mother. Jesus was not an Edomite. Again, Jesus a Galillean.

"Jews" ie Alan Dirshowitz, Woody Allen.. are Asian, Mongol 7th century Converts. The 13th tribe. They dont look Semitic or Arab like, because they Arent! The word "JEW" did Not even exist until the 18th century..


33,000 Christian Sects & counting after the Protestant revolt..Its very simple, heres a visual

Here are Evangelical Christians, now 60% of US Christians, worshipping a statue of George Bush, from the Movie Jesus Camp & Encouraging warfare. Talk about Idol Worship..
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5CgvgjfwyPs

Here is a Latin Mass, practiced for over 1900 Years. What is more pleasing to God?
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vMJaDU7x_Xo&feature=related
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PostPosted: 03/10/08, 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When did this site go from GWP site to a religious site? Come on you two grow up.....
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PostPosted: 03/10/08, 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

whiskerdog1 wrote:
ME-I nevre played hockey-could be it!


It explains a lot!
Quote:
There was 1 Church ( Not counting the Greek Schism) until Martin Luther posted his treatise & Protestant Revolt. Everyone but you understands this.
If you cant accept that, there is no discusison. I cant argue with the uninformed.


Why is it you deny basic reality! In favor of your "I am part of the original church" Dogma?
Peter was the apostle to the JEWS! As recorded in Scripture! Paul was the Apostle to the Gentiles! Every Church that Paul Founded what taught by Paul and accepted Paul's message of salvation by GRACE alone. This was the fundamental teaching which Luther had a problem with. The Catholic Church had lost this clear teach and put people under a system of laws or works that you must do to get to heaven. Luther rightly rejected that and all other heresies being taught by the Catholic Church at that time.


Quote:
If you wish to claim there were abuses in the church..still are, Ill grant you that. Ill grant you 40 Anti Popes in Church history. But I wont throw out the proverbial baby with the bathwater as you or Luther, but prefer to believe Christ' promise of "the Gates of Hell wont prevail upon My Church"


The Gates of Hell won't prevail over the fact the Jesus was the messiah which is what he is referring to in your quote. Bill institutions once they get corrupted don't get better. Just look at our government is it going to get better on its own? No it isn't. This is the same for all institutions. Look at Harvard, Yale and so many of those universities. They were founded to spread the gospel but now they are wholly anti Christian. Are we going to make them Christian again? No we aren't we just need to oppose the foolish liberal nonsense they teach and let them fold under the weight of their own lies.

Quote:
Hagee Claims
1. "Jews did not reject Jesus" Completely False-("CRUCIFY HIM, MAY HIS BLOOD BE UPON US & OUR CHILDREN!")
2. "Jesus did not come to earth to be the Messiah".. False-"I am He"


I haven't read his book and neither have you.. That is a sound bite to get your attention he is SELLING a BOOK!


Quote:
Jesus addressed Peter as.."You are Peter & upon THis Rock, I will build My CHURCH"


What rock is Jesus referencing? Why anyone with even the simplest understanding of the human language would understand it was what Peter had just said that He was the Messiah the son of the living God.

Lets look again at it in context Bill okay;

13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?”
14 So they said, “Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 And I also say to you that you are Peter [petros in the original greek], and on this rock [petra in the original greek] I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed[d] in heaven.”
20 Then He commanded His disciples that they should tell no one that He was Jesus the Christ.

Jesus used a play on words Bill, he did that a lot! He spoke in parables so that those who didn't put their faith in HIM wouldn't come to a knowledge of the truth.

He said you are a stone Peter.. Notice how the first time in that sentence he calls him Simon, then He calls him Peter [petros] and then He says on the [petra] ROCK which you uttered, that He was the messiah is what his Church was going to be built upon. Which is why He told them not to tell anyone.

You can try to pull that statement out of context to get your pretext but it only harms you to do so.

Quote:
Saint Peter was the Most Prominent of Jesus Christ's Disciples. Originally named Simon son of Jonah (Matt. 16:17), he was given the Aramaic name Cephas BY Jesus; the name means "rock" & is translated into Greek as Peter. Jesus Trained his disciples personally. Paul Never ever Knew Jesus..


Peter was the most prominent I agree until Jesus cut off the Jews at the stoning of Stephen. That is where God gets Paul saved in the next Chapter of Acts. And then in the next chapter after that gives Peter an object lesson that God is going to the gentiles with out him. You see in the 10 chapter of Acts Peter wouldn't even go into the house of a gentile since that was against Jewish law. Peter says that he wouldn't do it to God. God has to prompt him 3 times to get him to go. Where he shows Peter what his is doing with out him. From then on Paul is the central Character of the book of acts. Peter is in the back ground.

Paul Knew Jesus that is were he got his message from. Did moses know God? How about Abraham? Of course they did and so did Paul..


Quote:
Peter is pictured as a leader & spokesman of the disciples; he identifies Jesus as Messiah (Mark 8:27; Matt. 16:16) He is several times mentioned with the brothers James and John, with whom he witnesses the Transfiguration and Jesus' agony in Gethsemane.
After Jesus' arrest Peter denies knowing him 3 times (as Jesus foretold) & repented his denial (Matt. 26:69-75; John 18:10-27).


Yes he was but you don't get it! Paul was who GOD choose to go to the Gentiles! You are a Gentile.


Quote:
In Acts, Peter is a Leader in the Jerusalem church & engages in Missionary activity in Samaria, Galilee, Lydda, Sharon, & Joppa.


He wouldn't even go into a Gentiles home! not much of missionary if you won't go into their home. Which is why God has to prompt Peter 3 times in the 10 chapter of acts to get him to go.
Quote:

Peter favors Admission of Gentiles into the church but occupies a middle position between James (the "brother" of Jesus), who wants to keep Christianity very Jewish in practice, & Paul, who wishes to minimize requirements for Gentile converts.


Peter only favors it because God showed him that he was going to go to the gentiles with out him. You see that in the 10 chapter of Acts. Read IT!

Quote:
Peter was Crucified by Nero, upside down in Rome.

So what Stephen was the first martyr so that means he was better than Peter right? Many many people throughout history were killed because they wouldn't renounce their faith in Jesus.

Quote:
Mary was a descendent of the Israelite line. Mary was a Virgin Mother. Jesus was not an Edomite. Again, Jesus a Galillean.


You are trying to split hairs to justify your hatred of all things jewish.

Quote:
"Jews" ie Alan Dirshowitz, Woody Allen.. are Asian, Mongol 7th century Converts. The 13th tribe. They dont look Semitic or Arab like, because they Arent! The word "JEW" did Not even exist until the 18th century..


More evidence of the above...

Quote:
33,000 Christian Sects & counting after the Protestant revolt..Its very simple, heres a visual


Here is a good synopsis of how all the churches came to be:

Quote:
How the Christian "families" evolved:

With the exception of the first few years after the execution of their founder Yeshua of Nazareth (a.k.a. Jesus Christ), Christianity was never a unified religion.

By the end of the 1st century CE three main movements remained:
Pauline Christians: a group of mainline congregations, largely of non-Jewish Christians. Some had been created by Paul and his co-workers. They evolved to become the established church.
Gnostic Christians: They claimed salvation through special, otherwise secret gnosis (knowledge). Some were members of mainline congregations; others were part of Gnostic groups. They were declared heretics and were gradually suppressed and exterminated.
Jewish Christians: remnants of the group originally headed by James, the brother of Yeshua, and including Jesus' disciples. They were scattered throughout the Roman Empire after the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE, and gradually disappeared.
Circa 400 CE: The Bishop of Rome began to be recognized as the most senior of all bishops. Siricius (384-399 CE) became the first bishop to be called Pope.
1054 CE: A lengthy power struggle between eastern and western Christianity culminated in a schism between the Eastern Orthodox churches and the Western Rite (later often called the Roman Catholic Church). Many Christian sects broke away from the Western Rite throughout the Middle Ages (Cathars, Knights Templars, etc.). These were generally exterminated by the central church in various genocidal wars.
1517 CE: Martin Luther attacked certain practices and beliefs of the Church, and the authority of the Pope. He was followed by other reformers which produced a mass movement -- the Protestant Reformation. They were driven largely by two fundamental principles:
"Sola Scriptura" (Scripture Alone): The belief that the Holy Bible was the ultimate authority for all matters of religious belief and practice.
The Priesthood of all Believers: The belief that no priest or other intermediary is needed between the Christian believer and God.

Quote:
Here are Evangelical Christians, now 60% of US Christians, worshipping a statue of George Bush, from the Movie Jesus Camp & Encouraging warfare. Talk about Idol Worship..
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5CgvgjfwyPs


They aren't worshiping him as God! They are praying for Him as the bible say to do. Pray for those in authority!

Quote:
Here is a Latin Mass, practiced for over 1900 Years. What is more pleasing to God?
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vMJaDU7x_Xo&feature=related


Wow that is nice soothing music! To bad they could be praying to the devil himself and I wouldn't know since I can't understand latin. Thus it is all just a nice concert like an opera in which I can't understand a single thing they say in Italian but is sure was sung nice.

Bill it is about a relationship with Jesus not about the style of worship! It is that debate that has caused so many denominations. [/quote]
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PostPosted: 03/11/08, 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hagee is a known Heretic.
Denounced as such, by any credible Christian Denominational Leadership.
Denying Jesus as Messiah & Jewish responsiblity from Deicide & Pimping more war, even against Middle Eastern Christians, is heretical.

"Do some warfare over Mr president Bush" & his statue in tongues..is clearly demented & Idol worship, the evangelicals are known for. And odd, Catholics asking the Mother of God, to Pray For us, isnt met with the same disdain, as these evangelicals praying For/To Bush, from you. Smell the hypocrisy?

There was 1 and only 1 church with apostolic tradition, with selection of Vicars & Popes. Many Liturical Protestants still accept the Council Teachings!..
Protestant is derived from the word... PROTEST.
One must Protest, that which has already been established. You lose all credibility trying to rationalize the irrational.
THere were No Protestants UNTIL Luther. Then Pandoras box..33,000 and counting.
Any & All "Churches" that practiced Heresy (Arian, Nestorian etc el al) were Put down. There was a Unifying Body & structure to all, as Ive stated.

If you question Peter as the greatest disciple OF Jeses & Apostle, youre free to do so, innerrantly. You you cannot question the fact that there was 1 church body, with a hierarchial structure, until Martin Luther. There were no Lutherans, Presbyterians, Methodists, Evangelicals, Pentecostal Snake Charmers or 33,000 other such Sects.

Luther, who Married a Nun & Fathered 6 children by her, once distanced from the church, did the Devils work, (as you do), & Divided the Church power, became a terrible Anti Semite (authored Jews & Their Lies) & was directly responsible for having Caused the 30 Year War, then the 7 Year War, weakening Prussia greatly.

Were it not for Luther..we would not have had the French Revolution, Spanish Civil War, Communist Bolshevism, WW1, WW2 & this present Disaster in the Middle East
Luther is Also for helping initiate Fraticide amongst 33,000 Chritian Denominations, devouring one another with heresies.

Your brother made an uninformed remark earlier about the 3rd Reich, Germany & the VDD.
He never saw this, Id imagine. He is also ignorant of history. And from a Jewish agency, I might add.
http://americandefenseleague.com/judea_declares_war_on_germany.htm
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PostPosted: 03/11/08, 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

whiskerdog1 wrote:
Hagee is a known Heretic.
Denounced as such, by any credible Christian Denominational Leadership.
Denying Jesus as Messiah & Jewish responsiblity from Deicide & Pimping more war, even against Middle Eastern Christians, is heretical.

"Do some warfare over Mr president Bush" & his statue in tongues..is clearly demented & Idol worship, the evangelicals are known for. And odd, Catholics asking the Mother of God, to Pray For us, isnt met with the same disdain, as these evangelicals praying For/To Bush, from you. Smell the hypocrisy?

There was 1 and only 1 church with apostolic tradition, with selection of Vicars & Popes. Many Liturical Protestants still accept the Council Teachings!..
Protestant is derived from the word... PROTEST.
One must Protest, that which has already been established. You lose all credibility trying to rationalize the irrational.
THere were No Protestants UNTIL Luther. Then Pandoras box..33,000 and counting.
Any & All "Churches" that practiced Heresy (Arian, Nestorian etc el al) were Put down. There was a Unifying Body & structure to all, as Ive stated.

If you question Peter as the greatest disciple OF Jeses & Apostle, youre free to do so, innerrantly. You you cannot question the fact that there was 1 church body, with a hierarchial structure, until Martin Luther. There were no Lutherans, Presbyterians, Methodists, Evangelicals, Pentecostal Snake Charmers or 33,000 other such Sects.

Luther, who Married a Nun & Fathered 6 children by her, once distanced from the church, did the Devils work, (as you do), & Divided the Church power, became a terrible Anti Semite (authored Jews & Their Lies) & was directly responsible for having Caused the 30 Year War, then the 7 Year War, weakening Prussia greatly.

Were it not for Luther..we would not have had the French Revolution, Spanish Civil War, Communist Bolshevism, WW1, WW2 & this present Disaster in the Middle East
Luther is Also for helping initiate Fraticide amongst 33,000 Chritian Denominations, devouring one another with heresies.

Your brother made an uninformed remark earlier about the 3rd Reich, Germany & the VDD.
He never saw this, Id imagine. He is also ignorant of history. And from a Jewish agency, I might add.
http://americandefenseleague.com/judea_declares_war_on_germany.htm


Bill is it possible for someone out side of your "church" to put their faith in Jesus Christ?

Or is it necessary to follow the works of the Catholic Church to get to heaven? BTW can you show me where in the bible that a church service needs to be held in Latin? Oh you can't just another one of your traditions of men which Luther PROTESTED against..

Funny how you think the REFORMATION :a 16th-century movement for the reform of abuses in the Roman Catholic Church ending in the establishment of the Reformed and Protestant Churches.
is responsible for all the wars.. Yeah if they would have just stayed under the thumb of a apostate Catholic Church then things would have been just fine..

Bill you do realize that Paul wrote in his Epistle to Timothy that in the later times men will come teaching heresies that

1The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. 2Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. 3They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.

You see Bill this heresy of the Catholic Church is the result of deceiving sprits. It has caused untold harm to countless thousands. Since in the 50' the Catholic Church said that a HOMO can be a good Priest so long as he is celibate just like a Hetero priest. Well you see what that bad idea caused. It brought much shame on Christianity.

Their false doctrine that a priest must take a vow of celibacy helps to destroy the gospel message of Salvation by Grace through Faith. Once you have one false teaching then they compound on each other especially when Scared Tradition is your standard. That is not something unchanging. It just rules made up by men and at some point a sacred tradition gets started. This is why Luther had 95 treatise which he could biblically and logically defend as heresy being taught by the Catholic Church. Now if you care to try to do what the Bishops and priests of that day could not and refute them I am all ears..

Until then just answer my three questions above directly and I will leave you.. And allow this dead GWP site to go back its catacombs.
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PostPosted: 03/11/08, 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ME wrote:
And from what a buddy of mine tells me about the FT game it is about run and having a broke dog. That is it.. If you bring a broke dog you got a chance of winning every time. Not much to that then really, just a steady run away dog..


Your buddy must have a kennel full of Field Champions and a room full of trophies. Since you have never seen a field trial and have to rely on hearsay for your wee bit of knowledge on the subject, how about entering one of the trials at Portage this Spring and showing us how easy it is to win.
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PostPosted: 03/11/08, 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony wrote:
ME wrote:
And from what a buddy of mine tells me about the FT game it is about run and having a broke dog. That is it.. If you bring a broke dog you got a chance of winning every time. Not much to that then really, just a steady run away dog..


Your buddy must have a kennel full of Field Champions and a room full of trophies. Since you have never seen a field trial and have to rely on hearsay for your wee bit of knowledge on the subject, how about entering one of the trials at Portage this Spring and showing us how easy it is to win.


Well Tony you have said the same thing! Want to win bring a broke dog!

I know there is a lot of training that goes into getting a dog to run far out of the way. To get it to run way to far to be useful for the foot hunter.. Oh that is right since you have foot stakes that means it is just like hunting.

Heck even Vern admits that his FC GWP female was useless hunting because she ran to big. But she could win those trials.

It is the game you like to play so have fun playing it...
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PostPosted: 03/12/08, 7:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gentlemen,
if you wish to discuss GWP's then do so, but as moderator, I am asking that the religion discussion be taken elsewhere.
This is not the place for it!

Thanks for your cooperation
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PostPosted: 03/12/08, 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Understood Dual.
Point was raised about Germany & a bet going to a Catholic Charity & Pandoras box is opened! My apologies.
If I might, Ill address MEs questions with this & take it back to dogs..

1. Hagee & Others are helping flock Leave Faith & Practice heresy.
Prots have openly Supported Abortion in defiance of Catholics in 1970s, (Read Bernard Nathanson-founder of NARAL & proponant of Roe V Wade), Divorce, contraception & issues condemned By the Vatican as destructive to morality & family. Catholics say Mass in native tongue (Greek, Arabic in other Rites). Latin was THE tongue when Rome ruled. Now a dead language & therefore Incorruptible.

2 Hagee, Falwell, Swaggert, Osteen & other Prominant Prots are such Liars also, worse in fact, imo..& Open Heretics
There are many Married Catholic priests..Orthodox Rites & Protestant Converts may be. Celibacy introduced in about 1200.

3 Prots have Gay ministers & Bishops, OPENLY in fact ie Presbyterians. And are now legally marrying Gay couples..Your argument is hollow.
Mistranslations in King James? Hundreds in fact
http://www.angelfire.com/hi2/graphic1designer/errors.html

Catholics have No food restrictions.
Fish is encouraged on Friday in remembrance of Christ, in honor of Good Friday & his death, but not required. One may offer up other acts in place of abstaining & Penance. Prayers etc
So, when we abstain, it's not because the food is impure; we're voluntarily giving up something good, for our spiritual benefit.
Your seemingly ignorant of true Catholic tradition & Faith & Spout false but common myths.
You can have the Last word if you wish..

I would like to know from curiousity sake, why you havent run your dog in a trial. For grins, I would like to..though not AKC registered. Ran Nstra once & enjoyed it, I guess..Did well in fact.
You also may wish to have your dog certified as a tracker, through Deer Search, they conduct legitimate 20/40 blood tracking & Certs. Can be challenging.

Also, have you gone after the coveted VC title? Pros/Cons?...
Ive not run Navhda, but seems the "golden ring"
If not VDD, I would support Navhda, wish it hadnt become a registry however. There is now another group emerging. Will be interesting to see their success.
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PostPosted: 03/12/08, 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The answers are:

No
Yes
and NO then correct..


See you on judgement day since I guess we both believe we are right!

BTW pointing to the sins of others is no way to justify biblical error...


On that Day Jesus will either say "well done good and faithful servant" or say "away from me you evil doer I never knew you."


Haven't had the time or the inclination to run him in a trial. But when he was young I have been told by some who saw him run that he would have done well. Wether they are blowing smoke up my ...... or not I don't know but that is a different game than what I hunt like.
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PostPosted: 03/13/08, 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ME wrote:
Well Tony you have said the same thing! Want to win bring a broke dog!

I know there is a lot of training that goes into getting a dog to run far out of the way. To get it to run way to far to be useful for the foot hunter.. Oh that is right since you have foot stakes that means it is just like hunting.


That's right, you can't win without a broke dog. It is a minimum standard for adult stakes. You should be able to relate to minimum standards being a hunt test guy.

An AKC Gun Dog stake is basically a classy/forward/hard hunting dog with perfect manners on his birds. He hunts, handles, backs when he sees another dog on point, and points his birds with style and intensity. The distance between the dog and handler is not as important as where the dog will go to find birds.

All of my dogs are foot hunted on wild birds. We have even been known to use a couple of FC's for guide dogs on the game farm.

There is a walking trial at Portage in early May. Why don't you come down and show us how easy it is to win.
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