German Wirehaired Pointer Club of America

oldsoul · Member Joined: 11 Feb 2004 Posts: 10

I am now half way through my 1 year old, female pups first pheasant/quail season. I am trying to expose her to as many birds as I can and so far we have shot a couple ( yea for us !! ). The grass here in Kansas this year is especially tall this year from a lot of rain I am told. I want to let her get out and do her thing and yet it is occasionally nearly impossible for me to see what she's doing. Though she didn't bump the aforementioned birds, I am fearful of making that mistake in the future. I think if I could keep her a little closer to me I could keep better track of her. Often when I tell her "lets go" she takes off for the hills. By the way Kansas isn't completely flat. I don't want to distract her hunting by nagging her to stay close but today for instance I lost her for close to two hours once she disappeared into an uncut milo field. I don't fault her for getting lost ( that stuff was extremely thick) but she doesn't seem to be able to keep track of me. Any ideas on keeping her close without overhandling her? Am I asking to much of her at this point?

birddog · Junior Joined: 01 May 2003 Posts: 63

What you have just posted confirms my reasons for starting a hunting puppy early. I will start a pup at 8 weeks by taking them for short walks in the field, say nothing to them and turn in different directions so as to make them keep their eye on me. When they start to become independent I will lay down in the grass, say nothing and when they realize I am not there, will look for me and by using their nose will find me. Once a pup can find you with their nose your chance of losing that pup is mostly over. They can find you in the heavest cover without you saying a word. You are way beyond this advice and what you have now is a very independent dog with more run then you desire. I feel the only way for you to gain control at this point is with the help of the e-collar. But before you use an e-collar you must make sure you know how to use it properly and your dog must be conditioned to it before you start any kind of correction. Your other option would be to seek help from a trainer. With their knowledge you would accomplish the end results a lot faster. JMO. Janet
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Hunting, Its what were all about!

Keith · Master Joined: 27 Dec 2002 Posts: 163

Do you have a beeper collar? And I whistle when I have to to let the dog know where I am.

Keith · Master Joined: 27 Dec 2002 Posts: 163

The birds will teach the dog how to handle them. Even if the dog is busting birds out of sight of you they are learning how to handle them and where to find them. And when they put it all together and you find your dog after a long search still on point and holding wild birds you will be very proud.

birddog · Junior Joined: 01 May 2003 Posts: 63

If I read the original post correctly Oldsoul stated he lost the dog for almost 2 hours. To me that dog was gone hunting and you could have 2 beeper collars on that dog and Oldsoul would not have heard them. Also, you would have to whistle through a microphone for a dog that far away to hear you. When the wind is blowing not many beeper collars or whistles can be heard. Just try it. Give a friend the whistle and you walk out in frount of him a good 100 yards or so. Beeper collar around your neck, or a bell, wind blowing, sometimes rain falling and see how far you can hear that toot of the whistle. A lot of times we feel our dog is not obeying, when in fact they just can't hear us. To teach a dog to find me is much more rewarding and takes very little handling once they understand I am not going to let them know where I am. It is up to them to find me if they get out to far. Also, by being silent helps keep the dog in closer because it wants to keep track of where you are. Again, what works for one does not always work for others.
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Hunting, Its what were all about!

Keith · Master Joined: 27 Dec 2002 Posts: 163

If the dog is self hunting I agree with your solution. Get an e-collar and put an end to it. It is unusual to have a wirehair that won't hunt for their master. But I have had dogs that would get off on a track, like a deer or armadillo, and ignore the comeback call. I cured this with e-collars.

dualgwp · Posted: 12/09/04, 10:53 am Post subject:

I think hunting very young dogs in really thick stuff is hard on both dog and handler. You don't know where they are, and don't know what they are or aren't doing.

Who knows? Maybe that pup of yours was on point in that thick stuff? If you had a collar on her, and hit her for not listening, you could very well make what was a good thing, into a very bad thing. Never use a collar to correct something you can't see.

I know it's tough, but I suggest hunting her (for now) in lighter cover where you can keep track of her whereabouts..... once she gets older and more experienced, and more trained, then you can let her go. Sometimes with the youngsters, we have to trade off where we want to hunt for the benefit of the dog down the road. Remember, this is a dog you will have for a long time to come.... one season does not make or break a dog.

She has to learn to listen, but this is done at home, in the backyard and reinforced in the field. A beeper will help you know where she is, how far off she is heading and should help you keep track of her. When the beeping begins to get feint, start calling for her...throw your voice in the direction you want her to appear....and keep walking.

Most all, enjoy your time out with her.

Keith · Master Joined: 27 Dec 2002 Posts: 163

I hunt in Oklahoma. If you or anyone else with a wirehair wants to ever get together and hunt in Oklahoma or Kansas let me know. Right now I have two 6 month old pups I am training. I also have a 3 year old male and a 5 year old female. I hunt quail, pheasants, and ducks mainly. With the occasional woodcock and snipe.

ME · Junior Joined: 13 Sep 2003 Posts: 65

If you do go hunt with Keith be prepared to HUNT..

And you better be a good shot because he can shoot and on singles you will have to be quick and accurate or you will just be watching.. Laughing

oldsoul · Member Joined: 11 Feb 2004 Posts: 10

Hey everybody, thanks for all the input. I think I should clarify a few things concerning her getting lost. I really don't think she was disobeying my calling or whistling for her. I don't think she could hear me and I KNOW she couldn't see me. This day she seemed distracted and I'm afraid I know what it was. I had a brother who was visiting from Alaska and he brought along his year old GWP as well. She and I usually hunt alone because I don't want any outside interference to come between us at this impressionable age. I thought he and I had an understanding that we would take turns hunting our dogs and that they would not both be off lead at the same time. Actually I didn't think he was even going to get his out of the vehicle. My girl was doing well and listening to me initially. Next thing I know, he had let his dog off it's lead and it was out mingling with my dog and interfering with our "connection" It was about this time that I was considering taking her back to the vehicle when she dissappeared into the milo. I have read advice not to hunt with others this first year and had resisted it up to this point. Ashamedly, this incident was largely my fault. Not only should I have known better but I did know better. I underestimated my brothers loyalty to me versus his desire to hunt his dog know matter what. He was apparently not willing to afford me the same consideration that I was willing to afford him. I figure the combination of another hunter ,another dog and thick cover was a recipe for disaster. Such a thing will never happen again. As the saying goes," fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me." Heck I'm only human. anyway, I appreciate all your advice and wish you all best of hunting luck this year and merry Christmas.

oldsoul · Member Joined: 11 Feb 2004 Posts: 10

Keith, I would absolutlely love to get together and do some hunting. It would be refreshing to hunt with someone who understands these dogs ( hunting dogs in general for that matter) and has respect for them and their education. Of course I don't know you from Adam but I feel fairly confident that you possess these qualities. I live in McPherson Kansas which is about an hour straight North of Wichita. Not a lot of public land right around here but there's plenty about an hour West. I'm pretty much in the same boat as most hunters in that I spend as much or more time hunting for a place to hunt as I do actually hunting the birds. I have a buddy and an acquaintance who have SOME private access which could possibly be utilized. I also have a brother in Enid OK who I have been considering hunting with around the first of the year. As far as ME's advice of being prepared to hunt hard with you, that's not even an issue. The part about needing to be a good shot is another matter (HA HA.) If you would like to pursue hunting together give me a call @ 1-620-241-5280 . I'm always receptive to meeting good people. Thanks again

Keith · Master Joined: 27 Dec 2002 Posts: 163

I really had fun with ME. It was a lot of fun hunting with another wirehair owner and watching his dog work. His dog did a real good job on quail and we got in some good shooting.

Keith · Master Joined: 27 Dec 2002 Posts: 163

I made the mistake of letting him in the pen with all my dogs. They mugged him. Since I am the only one that feeds my dogs I allow them to jump on me (I know I shouldn't but I do). I felt bad because they were jumping all over him. My two 6 month old pups are the worst. They will leap against you in their exuberance. So bad that he had to wash his clothes after the encounter.

shadowrocke · Member Joined: 15 Nov 2004 Posts: 10 Location: minnesota

I agree with the statements of using a beeper collar and an e-collar. With these I also use a check cord. Normally about 50 - 100 ft to start with. I hunt in MN so there are trees and such so I have to be careful that the dog doesn't become entangled. But at an early age this seems to work well. I have 6 wirehairs that I run. I have one that is a hunting fanatic and he will take off and self hunt if not running with an e-collar on. He will eventually come home, but its normally several hours.

ME · Junior Joined: 13 Sep 2003 Posts: 65

I can say this I had a blast hunting quail with Keith. He is good people!! He has a grouse hunt coming on me and I hope he has as much fun as I did hunting quail..

I don't think you will be dissapointed in his dogs desire or their ability or his SHOOTING ability. It seemed that every time a covey got up from under a point he got a double. He shoots an O/U TOO. Very good at controlling himself and shooting with disipline...