German Wirehaired Pointer Club of America Forum Index German Wirehaired Pointer Club of America
AKC Parent Club for the German Wirehaired Pointer
 
 ForumForum FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
 gwpca bulletin boardGWPCA Home Page   gwpca bulletin boardBulletin Board   gwpca bulletin boardGWPCA Rescue Page 

Color of puppies
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    German Wirehaired Pointer Club of America Forum Index -> General Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
kansasgwp
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 22 Dec 2002
Posts: 3

PostPosted: 12/22/02, 4:35 pm    Post subject: Color of puppies Reply with quote

I am new to the German wire-haired pointer breed. I have a female that is a year old and truly enjoy her. I am looking at a litter of puppies so I can purchase a second GWP. In the litter there are 4 that are completely white, there appears to be a trace of orangish tint about the head and ears. Is this a common coloring for young puppies and if so will they stay light colored? Finally, is this an exceptable coloration? In my internet research I find black and whites are discriminated against but nothing about white ones.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
cmmilach
Senior
Senior


Joined: 23 Oct 2002
Posts: 113
Location: Centennial, CO

PostPosted: 12/23/02, 6:29 pm    Post subject: Color of puppies Reply with quote

Hi,

White is an acceptable color. Some people prefer them when hunting because they are easier to see than the liver & whites or roans.

My male was born white with a dark head & when I picked him up at 9 weeks he was still white with the dark head, he is now eight yrs old & is liver ticked.

Good luck in your search!

Cathy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Deb Finstad
Junior
Junior


Joined: 21 Oct 2002
Posts: 71
Location: Minneapolis, MN

PostPosted: 12/27/02, 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you saying that even the head and ears are white (or light orange) on these puppies? That isn't an acceptable color as far as I know. Even dogs that have white bodies should have liver heads and ears - not orangish and most certainly not white. How old are these puppies you were looking at?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dualgwp
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 491
Location: New Hope PA

PostPosted: 12/29/02, 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The standard for the breed states:
The "head is liver, sometimes with a blaze, the ears are liver"

The coat can be any combination of liver and white with either color being dominant. And they certainly do come black and white as well. At this time, the black and white dogs are not preferred in the show ring.

Sometimes, in a litter there will be "mismarks" where a puppy will have white on it's ears, or on the head not covering the eyes. If you want to stay strickly with the standard most will stray away from a mismarked puppy. Especially is you want to show or breed the dog in the future. Mismarks make fine hunting dogs and pets, but in my opinion should probably be spayed or neutered. A Wire puppy should not appear "orange" at all... liver, black, yes... NOT orange.....

Most Wire pups are born pretty white (but with dark heads and ears at birth) and they darken with age. Puppies that are going to stay mostly white sometimes have pink pads and or noses at birth, and they too darken daily. Puppies that are going to "tick in" or end up as roans will look dirty around the paws and down the back. Solid Livers are born solid liver.

Hope this helps
Dualie
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
kansasgwp
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 22 Dec 2002
Posts: 3

PostPosted: 12/29/02, 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The puppies are six weeks old and there is no sign of liver on them.[/img]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
dualgwp
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 491
Location: New Hope PA

PostPosted: 12/31/02, 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kansas was able to send me a photo of the puppies he was speaking about. One of them is liver and white and it appears that it will be a darker liver roan as an adult.
The other two were, well, hmmmmm, orange and white.
It is possible for a litter of puppies to have different sires and from this picture this very well may be the case. The only two breeds I am aware of that have orange pigments (pointing breeds) would be a brittany and a pointer.
A DNA test can be performed to see if indeed the stated sire is indeed the sire of all of the pups, or just some. But I would be leary of a litter where some of the pups are a totally unacceptable color.
Just my humble opinion!
Dualie
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Deb Finstad
Junior
Junior


Joined: 21 Oct 2002
Posts: 71
Location: Minneapolis, MN

PostPosted: 12/31/02, 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DualGWP -

Spinone's can also be that orangish color, in fact the coloring on the pups was like a number of that breed that I've seen.

Deb
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dualgwp
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 491
Location: New Hope PA

PostPosted: 12/31/02, 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whoops! Your right... forgot all about Spinone's
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
kansasgwp
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 22 Dec 2002
Posts: 3

PostPosted: 12/31/02, 4:24 pm    Post subject: Thank you Reply with quote

I have elected to wait for another litter of puppies to become available in my area. I greatly appreciate the interest, time, and efforts from all involved in this decision.

Thank you again,
Bentley
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Jon P
Senior
Senior


Joined: 30 Nov 2002
Posts: 93

PostPosted: 01/06/03, 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So does the GWPCA intend to make an inquiry into these "Wirehairs"?
_________________
Jon P
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dualgwp
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 491
Location: New Hope PA

PostPosted: 01/06/03, 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have asked Kansas to supply me with a name of the breeder. So far no answer. If I don't have this information, no one can do a darn thing.
Jon, you are more than welcome to start digging and see what info you can come up with.
Stop looking for dirt, start to try to help.
Bernee
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Jon P
Senior
Senior


Joined: 30 Nov 2002
Posts: 93

PostPosted: 01/06/03, 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm sure the club has a procedure for such inquiries. What are organizations for?
_________________
Jon P
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
drafter4
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 3

PostPosted: 02/20/03, 2:09 pm    Post subject: Color of puppies Reply with quote

I have purchased a male wirehair from the litter I believe to be talked about. After I purchased this pup I started to do some investigating. All of you may be surprised at my findings. I contacted an officer at the GWPCA and sent pictures of my pup. The reply was it looks like a yellow lab with a beard. This person sent my pictures to another person in the GWPCA ( a long standing breeder in the breed) Before she received the pictures, she would have said the same thing. BUT, her bitch had 2 pups that very morning the very same color. She is researching this thru a genetisist to find out why this color abnormality comes about. Am I happy with my pup.
"You bet" and I have asked for first consideration to purchase the newly born mis-colored pup. This will not affect their hunting ability in any way.
This family has a couple pups left that will make excellent hunters. ""But""
should not be bred.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Jon P
Senior
Senior


Joined: 30 Nov 2002
Posts: 93

PostPosted: 02/21/03, 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With two litters coming up with this abnormality, sounds like there may be enough information to track down where this is coming from. Maybe someone could do a little pedigree analysis and produce some useful information.

The remaining question is will the rest of the litter carry forward markers that will express themselves at a later time?
_________________
Jon P
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
drafter4
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 3

PostPosted: 02/21/03, 12:10 pm    Post subject: color of puppies Reply with quote

I really beleive these 2 instances are not the only instances that have occurred. I think that if it has happened it has been kept quiet. People I have talked to have said they have heard of it before. One person even told me that they had read somewhere that early in the breeding this color was common, but not popular because of the visibility by birds in a duck blind. I have given the names of the owners and dogs to a person that has taken on the task of a pedigree search to see if they are in fact related. I would be willing to bet not and that it is just a semi-rare case of recessive genetics.
I would hope that more people that know of this happening would join in. As in any other breed or species for that matter there has been a standard dictated by clubs. This does not mean that other things cannot happen. I raise percheron horses. People always think of a beautiful black horse. Other colors are looked down on by the top breeders and show people. The fact is colors can also be bay to sorrel. When they are foaled in some barns they are put down so no one knows. I think that also happens with dogs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    German Wirehaired Pointer Club of America Forum Index -> General Chat All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group